Condenser Mic for Live acoustic gig

[alohachris]

Aloha Bill,

Everyone here who gigs can certainly relate to your concerns & words. I've been gigging for most of five decades & have had to endure my share of howling feedback, frowns of horror from the crowd or manager, not being heard clearly by anyone - including me, inability to "dial in" a live sound I can live with, & the worst, ear fatigue.

As Doug mentioned, pickup technology has gotten much better (K&K's, Aura modelling technology, Schertler DYN-G's contacts, dual+ source systems, Higher headroom Wavelength UST's, better sounding magnetics, etc.), but microphones pretty much remain the same.

I feel it is a combination of a pickup & a mic that will yield the sound, control & flexibility I'm after - along with other control tools & options within my planned live signal chain. But you must bring & have mastered using the tools that can best prepare you for using guitar mic's in the rooms your playing & for the variety of gigs you may face - solo/group, noisy/quiet, indoors/outdoors, etc.

Like you, I use three gigging guitars to accomodate various tunings. I have a K&K mini/ AKG 416 internal mic in each. I plug these into a great preamp with superior parametric EQ. My signal chain gives me the sound, flexibility & control I need. Having the same dual-source system in each guitar also makes switching them out a snap, with minor EQ adjustments.

Bill, if you don't have great EQ, then you really need to educate yourself on the options available because there are some good ones available now. And there are some very popular bad ones too. EQ is your number one friend when using mic's in a variety of rooms. But only great EQ!

I chose to use the AKG 416 hypercardioid internal mic, because it lessens the chance for a feedback loop to develop. In fact, it's never fedback - ever! When it's quiet, I'll add an external mic to the mix. If it's loud or the stage suddenly becomes crowded with friends who want to plug in, I turn off the mic's & slap a Magmic magnetic soundhole mic in & blend that with the K&K or use it alone. Then I can get loud too. It's about preparation & having compatible tools in your signal chain.

Using mic's in a variety of rooms, as Doug said, you really need to master speaker/monitor placement as well. Can't do that with a single speaker amp. You need a dual-speaker PA system to control mic signals in many rooms.

For example, most of the time for solo gigs, you don't need monitors. I'd never put a guitar mic signal through wedge monitors at my feet anyway or place most PA's behind me or on the floor. You can place your PA speakers in such a way for you to hear yourself & yet, to not feedback - often at angles to where your playing. Get 'em well off the ground up on stands. It can vary from room to room. If you need a monitor, then place it on a stand behind you facing up at the ceiling, angled towards you.

The way I taught myself how to control mic signals & also speaker placement in different rooms was to schlepp my PA from room to room in my house, crank the mic's up & then figure out how/where to place the PA speakers in a way to be best heard & also to minimize feedback. I did that for months, learning how to control feedback. And it's certainly different from a cement cellar to a living room with furniture & carpeting, I'll tell ya. Good place to start with experimentation outside of your gigs.

At gigs, when I'm setting up, I run some of my recordings through my live rig at a fairly high volume, & then go for a stroll, listening for problem areas, or for better places to situate my PA speakers. It works! And I'll change it out on my break if it's not working. I also ask friends in the crowd for tips because the crowd often changes in volume throughout the night & so must my adjustments for mic's. You'd be surprised at how un-symetrical some of those speaker placements can be in some rooms. HA!

I really agree with Doug on keeping the volume down, if you can. Ear fatigue is a real drag - for you & your audience over the course of a gig. That's the main reason why I do not use UST's or magnetic pickups anymore - their compressed, un-natural, mid-rangey sound is EAR FATIGUE CENTRAL, BABY!

Bill, check out the EQ thing. Along with speaker placement, that's the only way to really control the great sounding, but sensitive condenser mic's like a 4099 in many rooms. If you don't have great EQ, then maybe you should look at dynamic hypercardioid mic's that are less feedback-prone. Here are a few decent ones:

External Dynamic Mic's that are feedback resistant & sound good:

EV N/D 967 - best feedback buster I've ever used - good on guitar/vocals
Shure Beta 57A
Beyer M69 - $
Sennheiser MD421 - $
Sennheiser e845 or e935,
Heil PR 35, $ guitar/vocals
Audix OM6 - guitar/vocals,

Pro level, Good to Great EQ, IMO

Pendulum Audio SPS-1 pre - $
DTAR Solstice pre
Soundcraft Notepad mixers
Allen & Heath Zed 10, 12 or 14FX mixers -really good EQ on these
Rane 1/3 octave stereo EQ units
Raven Labs PMD-1 & Highlander PAMDI - no longer made, but available

Finally Bill, don't let the tech talk drag you down. It's knowledge you're after, knowledge that down the road will get you out of a jam & lead to a live sound that will inspire you & your audience. Do the homework & try out some mic's But check out EQ & placement first so you can get that 4099 level up without feedback, OK.

Good Luck!
alohachris

[Kabalan]

i just commented this in the nylon forum:

i been using a beyerdinamic m-160 ribbon.
just for an information it is great guitar player,Ralph Towner, gear.
In a concert we talked about and he recommended me this mic.
in the video, he is using the mic
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmZbSETaHJA
and here with the 12 strings guitar; Ralph in the center
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=38k2W5UFyjM&NR=1

[min7b5]

Originally Posted by Kabalan

i just commented this in the nylon forum:

i been using a beyerdinamic m-160 ribbon.
just for an information it is great guitar player,Ralph Towner...

Hi Kabalan
Ralph Towner is one of my guitar heros for sure. And he always has great live sound on the nylon in particular. I thought he used a pickup, along with the mic for the twelve string, and then just the mic on the classical? Are you having good luck with the beyerdynamic ribbon? And are you use the same mic pre as Ralph?

[Kabalan]

Originally Posted by min7b5

Hi Kabalan
Ralph Towner is one of my guitar heros for sure. And he always has great live sound on the nylon in particular. I thought he used a pickup, along with the mic for the twelve string, and then just the mic on the classical? Are you having good luck with the beyerdynamic ribbon? And are you use the same mic pre as Ralph?

hi Eric, first, i really enjoy your playing!!
I been using this mic for a long time, yes i like it very much,
when i meet Ralph in 88, he had a chip preamp Simetrik! i dont think he
use something sophisticate, in his new videos with a trumpet player, he have
a small mixer; the beyerdinamic, since it is a ribbon, needs a lot of preamp
gain, i use a small tc electronic preamp, in a small venue just the mic, but
i do a lot of festivals in open venues, for this i add a AKG C 411 contact
mic, just to get a stoat sound, but the beyer like main source(more natural)
i play 8 strings classical and 6 steel strings and mexican 10 strings jarana.
all with lexicon reverb.
for me, Towner had been my teacher(just with the records and videos) since the 70´S. with Oregon and solo concerts, sometimes we match in the
same city; i just go after concert to say hi( he is nice, but it is serious man)
Eblen

[alecsandor]

Personally, I prefer piezo for small gigs to avoid feedback, but for larger venues I opt for Audio Technica, they're really cool microphones and they're cardioid condenser, created especially for live performances. Good luck!