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Old 12-02-2017, 11:15 AM
charles Tauber charles Tauber is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carbonius View Post
What drives me crazy is when a new guitar can't even handle octaves past the 5th fret.


I've found most new steel string guitars play well up to and past the 12th fret.

My experience is that very, very few factory-made guitars - steel string or nylon - are adequately intonated to my satisfaction. (Taylor steel strings are a notable exception.)

It's now clear that the issue you are talking about is beyond intonation. I've written about this many times, and I don't know how much of this you already know, so I'll keep this brief.

There are three components to having an instrument "play in tune". The first is the choice of temperament: temperament determines what are the desired pitches. The second in intonation: intonation is the ability of an instrument to accurately achieve the desired pitches. The third is the method used to "tune" the instrument.

Guitars are almost universally designed to equal temperament. As Brian pointed out, the human ear doesn't want to hear equal temperament: it hears specific notes in equal temperament to be out of tune.

Guitars can be setup to very closely achieve the notes of equal temperament. Except for those with exceptional hearing, this can be done acceptably with a good setup that includes compensation at the saddle. For most people, in most circumstances, in my opinion, compensation at the nut doesn't add much, particularly with nylon string guitars. If you think a compensated nut will help, give it a try.

Even with an equal temperament guitar, with good intonation, the method of tuning the guitar is critical to having it "play in tune". Equal temperament is a compromise that allows one to play equally in tune and equally out of tune in all keys. That is why it is used. The best that one can get with a well setup, well-intonated guitar is that it accurately plays in equal temperament. That will sound somewhat out of tune, in known, predictable ways.

What people often do is to "tweak" the tuning away from equal temperament to make is sound more in tune for a specific key(s) in which one is playing. (If the intonation isn't good, this will be an exercise in chasing one's tail.) Doing so compromises, further, the tuning in other keys. There is no "free ride" - tweaking the tuning to sound better in some circumstances makes it sound worse in other circumstances.

In short, equal temperament is a given, the intonation needs to be setup well, and rarely is on factory-made guitars, steel or nylon string, and one needs to use a method of tuning that is consistent with the compromises used in equal temperament.

As a final note, on steel string guitars, it is the B string that is usually out and needs greater compensation. On nylon string guitars it is usually the G string.
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