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Pine 01-05-2017 11:42 AM

Strumming Speed Problems
 
Hey everyone. I'm a late stage beginner (JustinGuitar.com), trying to get my strumming speed up to some beginner song videos I purchased. Bad Moon Rising is one of them, and is played at 180BPM.

I've been practicing using Justin's Strumming Techniques V1, which consists of 20 8th note strumming patterns.

I've gotten my speed up to between 130 and 140, depending on the exercise pattern, but my strumming falls apart badly above 140. I've been focusing on relaxing. have been stuck at this speed for a month and a half. I practice these strumming patterns for half an hour a day, 6 days a week.

Any helpful tips would be appreciated. (Or have I reached terminal velocity?)

Some other info:
Guitar: Blackbird lucky 13
I'm using a metronome for this practice
I use a Neck-up, so headstock is shoulder high
Pick: Blue Chip TPR.35
I'm a lefty playing RH
66 years old

JonPR 01-05-2017 12:14 PM

See if this helps:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H06_0ApzkzY
Notice the arm movement is quite small, not a big swing; that lets them play faster. There's still movement at the elbow (the arm is relaxed), but the main move is from the wrist.

Its also important that it's swing feel, so any 8th notes (upstrokes in between) are delayed. (That's a whole other skill to master, to differentiate between straight and swing rhythms.;))

Pine 01-05-2017 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonPR (Post 5182290)
See if this helps:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H06_0ApzkzY
Notice the arm movement is quite small, not a big swing; that lets them play faster. There's still movement at the elbow (the arm is relaxed), but the main move is from the wrist.

Its also important that it's swing feel, so any 8th notes (upstrokes in between) are delayed. (That's a whole other skill to master, to differentiate between straight and swing rhythms.;))

Thanks for the video. I like how he sings "there's a bathroom on the right". LoL

I hadn't noticed the swung rhythm until you mentioned it. Like most of the rhythms I've practiced, I'm ok up to 120-130-140. Above that all bets are off.

I've taken videos of my practice with the iPad. Strumming movement is small, but not as relaxed as I'd like. like most, I tense up when pushing speed. I'm getting better at relaxing though.

I have the "Guitar Player's Guide to Developing Speed, Accuracy and Tone" book I got at the same time as the first 2 Flatpicking Essentials books. It has a nice section on right hand mechanics. He talks about relaxation, body position, holding the pick, pick choices, attack, strum arc, and lots of other information. Unfortunately, all this info hasn't helped with my strumming speed issues though. It just feels like I've hit a barrier at 140BPM.

JonPR 01-06-2017 05:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pine (Post 5182335)
Thanks for the video. I like how he sings "there's a bathroom on the right". LoL

Oh yes, one of the great "mondegreens". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mondegreen
The famous one from Purple Haze is "'scuse me while I kiss this guy", as Hendrix often used to sing it live (grabbing Noel Redding).

My own favourites (definitely OT) are "the ants are my friends, they're blowing in the wind"; and listen to this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxtfdH3-TQ4 - why is he singing "me ears are alight"? Cracks me up every time. :)

jstegeman 01-06-2017 10:03 AM

Good question :)

You are on the right track - being relaxed is a big part of it, as is strumming from the wrist. It will come with practice. I recently did a song that, when I initially practiced it, I thought I would never be able to strum at that speed, but with some practice and focus on technique, it worked out fine:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WRI1wtJjv90

Pine 01-06-2017 10:11 AM

Well, I think my musical knowledge is nearing completion. I now know what the term "mondegreen" means, and the actual words to "blowing in the wind" :)

It reminds me of the Beach Boys song where they admonish the woman with a breast prosthesis to treat others more kindly. You know the song .... "Oh wooden tit be nice". :D

Well, I'm better educated, and in better humor now, but still not strumming up to speed. I called a local guitar teacher I know to get a couple of hour sessions to see if he can get me fixed up. We'll see....

jstegeman 01-06-2017 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonPR (Post 5182998)
Oh yes, one of the great "mondegreens". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mondegreen
The famous one from Purple Haze is "'scuse me while I kiss this guy", as Hendrix often used to sing it live (grabbing Noel Redding).

My own favourites (definitely OT) are "the ants are my friends, they're blowing in the wind"; and listen to this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxtfdH3-TQ4 - why is he singing "me ears are alight"? Cracks me up every time. :)

There's a whole genre of videos on YouTube with Mondegreens, including Open Condom Star: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXdkbL6sRic

Pine 01-06-2017 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jstegeman (Post 5183235)
Good question :)

You are on the right track - being relaxed is a big part of it, as is strumming from the wrist. It will come with practice. I recently did a song that, when I initially practiced it, I thought I would never be able to strum at that speed, but with some practice and focus on technique, it worked out fine:[/url]

Thanks for the encouragement. I'm hoping it will come along.

I know these things are pretty undefined in the guitar world, but is strumming at this tempo (180BPM) a beginner level skill? Perhaps this song is more intermediate level due to the tempo. I don't want to skip over important skills before I move on to the intermediate course.

fazool 01-06-2017 11:59 AM

One of my (two) guitar mentors once said to me:

"you guys need to stop trying to figure out the up-down-up strum patterns and just *FEEL* the music".......

That one line changed my world as a guitar player.

I think it applies here as well.

SprintBob 01-06-2017 02:48 PM

If you are not already doing so, consider practice with a .38 to .46 mm thick pick to develop the speed and technique and then get thicker as needed or desired. I've been playing almost 4 years and I hit a wall at 150 bpm with 8th note strumming. I keep working at it, it will come. I use a .46 to .60 mm thick pick for this practice.

reeve21 01-06-2017 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fazool (Post 5183384)
One of my (two) guitar mentors once said to me:

"you guys need to stop trying to figure out the up-down-up strum patterns and just *FEEL* the music".......

That one line changed my world as a guitar player.

I think it applies here as well.

Amen--can I say that ? :-) -- to this. It took my a long time to find out that consistent strumming patterns are a sign of good timing, not a cause of it.

To the OP--try counting out loud to get your head out of the mechanics and let your subconscious mind take over. At the speed you want to achieve you may have to count every other beat. I find this even more effective than a metronome on pieces I'm struggling with. I'm also a big foot tapper, it goes back to my saxophone playing youth. Some will say it is distracting, but if it is good enough for Tommy Emmanuel.....

jstegeman 01-06-2017 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fazool (Post 5183384)
One of my (two) guitar mentors once said to me:

"you guys need to stop trying to figure out the up-down-up strum patterns and just *FEEL* the music".......

That one line changed my world as a guitar player.

I think it applies here as well.

I agree with that - I find if I try to actually think about the pattern and what it should be, it doesn't work, but if I feel the rhythm, the strumming comes naturally. If someone asks me how to play a certain strumming pattern, I have to actually stop and pay attention to what I'm doing, because most of the time, my brain doesn't really know, it just happens.

rmoretti49 01-07-2017 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jstegeman (Post 5183793)
I agree with that - I find if I try to actually think about the pattern and what it should be, it doesn't work, but if I feel the rhythm, the strumming comes naturally. If someone asks me how to play a certain strumming pattern, I have to actually stop and pay attention to what I'm doing, because most of the time, my brain doesn't really know, it just happens.

Practicing with a drum machine can be really helpful in this regard. With so many drum rhythms to choose from, and being able to alter BPM just like a metronome, it is easy to respond naturally and intuitively to what is being heard.

jomaynor 01-07-2017 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pine (Post 5182234)
Hey everyone. I'm a late stage beginner (JustinGuitar.com), trying to get my strumming speed up to some beginner song videos I purchased. Bad Moon Rising is one of them, and is played at 180BPM.

I've been practicing using Justin's Strumming Techniques V1, which consists of 20 8th note strumming patterns.

I've gotten my speed up to between 130 and 140, depending on the exercise pattern, but my strumming falls apart badly above 140. I've been focusing on relaxing. have been stuck at this speed for a month and a half. I practice these strumming patterns for half an hour a day, 6 days a week.

Any helpful tips would be appreciated. (Or have I reached terminal velocity?)

Some other info:
Guitar: Blackbird lucky 13
I'm using a metronome for this practice
I use a Neck-up, so headstock is shoulder high
Pick: Blue Chip TPR.35
I'm a lefty playing RH
66 years old

I'm not familiar with the tutorial that you are using, so it may already emphasize this, but keeping the wrist limber is crucial to strumming rapidly without fatigue. For extremely fast tempos, someone once told me to think of putting out a lit match, which gives the wrist the necessary snap.

Stay with it. One month may seem like a long time to be practicing the same thing over and over, but this is a long journey, so relax and enjoy the ride.

SprintBob 01-07-2017 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rmoretti49 (Post 5184362)
Practicing with a drum machine can be really helpful in this regard. With so many drum rhythms to choose from, and being able to alter BPM just like a metronome, it is easy to respond naturally and intuitively to what is being heard.

+1, it's much more fun to do this type of practice to a drum track.


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