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TJE
08-23-2010, 06:36 PM
Looking for some help with Willie's style of playing....they way he picks out the lead, or maybe as I heard someone say he does a lot of walking bass. Can some one help me with this?

P.S. I know he plays a classical...that's not what I'm after, rather the way he is playing.

Thanks, Tony

picker304
08-23-2010, 07:18 PM
Willie does alot of Bass followed by patterns in treble section. try this in E chord Make an E Major and play these strings. 6 3 (12) 3 5 3 (12) 3 Other chords you could use would be A = 5 3 (12) 3 4 3 (12) 3 and B7 = 5 3 (12) 3 5 3
(12) 3. If you're speaking of lead one of his favorite scales is the Phyrigian mode which in the key of E is 6/4 6/5 6/7 5/4 5/6 5/7 4/4 4/6 4/7 4/8 3/4 3/6 2/6 2/7. Last he uses bass travels alot try this one going from E to A chord 6/0 6/1 6/2 6/4 to A Hope this helps

explanations . On top section the numbers are the strings you play in each chord. when numbers are in parenthesis those are played at same time

On lead section fractions are string and fret ie 6/4 = 6th string 4th fret

TJE
08-23-2010, 07:36 PM
Yeah I think that ought to help....uhh I think it might be awhile before I can soak all of that in.

Thanks, Tony

picker304
08-23-2010, 07:46 PM
Yeah I think that ought to help....uhh I think it might be awhile before I can soak all of that in.

Thanks, Tony

Hey Tony copy and paste and take your time and I'm here if you need further assistance as many others can help you too

KSHillTopper
08-23-2010, 08:03 PM
Hey Tony,

I've been learning quite a bit of old-time country style of playing lately and i think i can help. Though i'm not too learned up on Willie's tunes, your description made it pretty obvious. Try this riff and let me know... (use open chords)

On the "Low" E string play Open, 2nd fret, 3rd fret then proceed to strum a G chord for a few beats, then do the exact same walk up (open, 2nd, 3rd) but on the A string and proceed to strum a C chord, strum out a D chord, then bring it all back to the G with the beginning riff and strum out the rest of the progression.

It's just a bass line walking up to each chord but it will get you in the right mind set for a more country-ish style.

RevGeo
08-24-2010, 07:46 AM
Willie's obvious jazz background shows itself in the rhythmic (and melodic) phrasing he uses in his solos. Also a lot of Latin sounding stuff.
He is one fine guitar player.

Rev George

mikedanton
08-24-2010, 07:55 AM
Willie's obvious jazz background shows itself in the rhythmic (and melodic) phrasing he uses in his solos. Also a lot of Latin sounding stuff.
He is one fine guitar player.

Rev George

Yeah, he's one of my favourite all round musicians/artists.

His solo playing is so tasteful. Unlike many other jazz influenced players I never want him to shut up.:)

Mike

TJE
08-24-2010, 12:46 PM
Thanks for the help guys. I think what I like about his playing the most is to me is that it is so different. I HAD one guitar teacher that thought his playing was terrible.

Thanks again, Tony

mr. beaumont
08-25-2010, 01:28 PM
Tony,

Willie's a jazz player in disguise. He's playing off the chord of the moment--meaning, that if the band is playing an A7, willie's target notes are A, C#, E, and G. He also will extend the vocabulary of the chord to include things like 6ths, 9ths and 13ths, and get to his target notes via chromatic passing tones (so in that A7 example, if he wants to get to G, he might start on E and walk his way up a half step at a time)

Willie was highy influenced by Django Reinhardt, and while there's no "Play like Willie" method, there's tons of books on Django's style.

If you like learning on your own, start learning the arpeggios for major and minor, maj7, m7, dominant 7th, and half diminished chords. When you play over a song, use the arpeggio of whatever chord you're playing over. It'll sound like "paint by numbers" for a while, but once you can visualize the fretboard in "chord tones," it becomes very natural to craft nice melodic statements on the fly that perfectly suit the "chord of the moment."

It takes time, and you'll have to practice a lot. I mean a lot--no shortcuts. The benefits to learning how to play like this are great, though, you'll be able to use the whole neck to improvise and never sound like you're stuck in a pentatonic box again.

TJE
08-25-2010, 04:35 PM
Tony,

Willie's a jazz player in disguise. He's playing off the chord of the moment--meaning, that if the band is playing an A7, willie's target notes are A, C#, E, and G. He also will extend the vocabulary of the chord to include things like 6ths, 9ths and 13ths, and get to his target notes via chromatic passing tones (so in that A7 example, if he wants to get to G, he might start on E and walk his way up a half step at a time)

Willie was highy influenced by Django Reinhardt, and while there's no "Play like Willie" method, there's tons of books on Django's style.

If you like learning on your own, start learning the arpeggios for major and minor, maj7, m7, dominant 7th, and half diminished chords. When you play over a song, use the arpeggio of whatever chord you're playing over. It'll sound like "paint by numbers" for a while, but once you can visualize the fretboard in "chord tones," it becomes very natural to craft nice melodic statements on the fly that perfectly suit the "chord of the moment."

It takes time, and you'll have to practice a lot. I mean a lot--no shortcuts. The benefits to learning how to play like this are great, though, you'll be able to use the whole neck to improvise and never sound like you're stuck in a pentatonic box again.

I'm think I understand what you are saying. lol I could use some help with a better understanding of what an arpeggio is? Also a phrygian scale?

The one thing I dislike about Willie's playing is, he never, or hardly ever plays rhythm. It looks like he is just plucking a string here and there, until he plays his solo lead run, or whatever it may be called. (this is what I mainly would like to be able to copy) I like to play more rhythm than he does. I'm sure there are some things he does I may not ever accomplish or might not ever need.

One thing I have to work around is my middle finger of my fret hand has been crushed with two surgery's. This makes some chords nearly impossible, but I keep trying.

Thanks for all the help, Tony

mr. beaumont
08-25-2010, 06:58 PM
an arpeggio is simply the notes of a chord played in succession. So that A7 chord example, an A7 arpeggio is A, C#, E, G.

Jazz players often view the fretboard in terms of arpeggios. This is a means of visualization, it does not mean I have to play those notes in that order over than chord. It also oesn't mean those are the only notes I can play, it just means they're good strong notes that fit that chord perfectly. In particular, the third and seventh of any chord (In this case, the second and fourth note of the arpeggio) are the strongest.

This knowledge is all based on major scale harmony...look it up, knowing how to build chords and harmonize the major scale is INVALUABLE. I need something better than just caps for that. INVALUABLE.

There, that's better.

A Phrygian scale can be thought of as the major scale (good old do re mi etc.) starting on mi and continuing thru mi. Confused? It can also be looked at as a scale that contains a root, b2, m3, 4th, 5th, and b6th.

Now I assume you're really confused.

So let's go back to that first example. Let's thart with the good old C major scale: C D E F G A B (and back to C)

but lets start it on the third note, E, and continue as normal, back to E.

E F G A B C D (E)

This is E Phrygian. Yes, it's the same notes as the C major scale. Phrygian is considered the third "mode" of the major scale--there's also modes based off starting on each of the other notes, each with it's own sassy greek name.

so E phrygian...what's it good for? Well, try this. Have a friend play Am--G--F--E in a "spanish" feel. You solo using your E Phrygian (same as C major--time to burn)

Sound sweet? This is only one application, but it's a common one. But I'd avoid those modes like the plague until you know the major scale INSIDE OUT. I see too many players get hung up on the modes, thinking they're some kind of magic elixer.

Major scale and harmony, knowing how to "build" chords and what notes are in them, fretboard knowledge (knowing where the notes are) and arpeggios. That's the secrets of being a better player right there, I promise.

TJE
08-25-2010, 08:42 PM
an arpeggio is simply the notes of a chord played in succession. So that A7 chord example, an A7 arpeggio is A, C#, E, G.

Jazz players often view the fretboard in terms of arpeggios. This is a means of visualization, it does not mean I have to play those notes in that order over than chord. It also oesn't mean those are the only notes I can play, it just means they're good strong notes that fit that chord perfectly. In particular, the third and seventh of any chord (In this case, the second and fourth note of the arpeggio) are the strongest.

This knowledge is all based on major scale harmony...look it up, knowing how to build chords and harmonize the major scale is INVALUABLE. I need something better than just caps for that. INVALUABLE.

There, that's better.

A Phrygian scale can be thought of as the major scale (good old do re mi etc.) starting on mi and continuing thru mi. Confused? It can also be looked at as a scale that contains a root, b2, m3, 4th, 5th, and b6th.

Now I assume you're really confused.

So let's go back to that first example. Let's thart with the good old C major scale: C D E F G A B (and back to C)

but lets start it on the third note, E, and continue as normal, back to E.

E F G A B C D (E)

This is E Phrygian. Yes, it's the same notes as the C major scale. Phrygian is considered the third "mode" of the major scale--there's also modes based off starting on each of the other notes, each with it's own sassy greek name.

so E phrygian...what's it good for? Well, try this. Have a friend play Am--G--F--E in a "spanish" feel. You solo using your E Phrygian (same as C major--time to burn)

Sound sweet? This is only one application, but it's a common one. But I'd avoid those modes like the plague until you know the major scale INSIDE OUT. I see too many players get hung up on the modes, thinking they're some kind of magic elixer.

Major scale and harmony, knowing how to "build" chords and what notes are in them, fretboard knowledge (knowing where the notes are) and arpeggios. That's the secrets of being a better player right there, I promise.

Not confused at all...you summed it up nicely. Now just putting it all into practice.

Thanks again everyone, Tony

bigbjfan
08-31-2010, 12:19 AM
I saw Willie live last year and I was close enough to see his fingers and what he was doing. He really impressed me. He basically played non-stop jazz solos all night and his fingers were so fast! This thread is just what I needed also as I've been trying to learn his style of playing and I know it is pretty advanced. Thanks for the tips. Now I have to make myself stick to a regimented practice routine.

TJE
08-31-2010, 06:58 AM
Thanks again for all the tips.

I've had two teachers over the years...both good players in there own right. One down right good, but he played like Ricky Scaggs....not something I really care for.
Yesterday I started calling around to see if I could find what I'm looking for in a teacher. I found a professor at the local university....who teaches jazz. He is very familiar with Willies style. I had my first lesson with him last night.

It was amazing what I learned in that first lesson....not just how to play a particular song. He actually gave me stuff to practice. I'll keep everyone posted on how it goes.
He also is almost double in price....hmmm somehow doesn't seem as expensive as the others where I learned nothing.

Regards, Tony

mr. beaumont
08-31-2010, 08:04 AM
I know it is pretty advanced.. .

It doesn't have to be though.

Knowing three arpeggio shapes for major7, minor7, dominant 7 and half diminished will get you very far. You should have an arpeggio that begins on the sixth string, fifth, and fourth for starters.

Those arpeggios are your "highlight" notes. Everything else essentially is fair game, your ears will teach you quickly whether the note is cool to hang on or if can only be used in passing.

The trickiest part is de-programming the brain to think "This song's in G, so I play in G." You're now treating each chord like it's own little environment. This requires some quick mental shifting once the tempos get up (you can always simplify the chord progresson for soloin too, but that's another conversation for another day)