Difficulty finding a good playing position

[PeterT]

When I use the classical position my left shoulder hurts.

Putting the guitar on my right leg is comfortable. However in that position I have difficulty fretting on the first four frets or so. I can do it but I can't get my thumb behind the neck and my palm and fingers are always touching the side of the neck. I think this will be a problem as I progress.

[mmmaak]

When I use the classical position my left shoulder hurts.
Welcome to the forums, Peter :)

It's good to experiment with all sorts of positions till you find the one that clicks. Like most other things guitar, there are compromises to be made.

If you like the classical position (other than the shoulder pain), perhaps we should try to find the source of your discomfort. Does it have anything to do with a physical condition? Also, one common mistake that players make when trying this position is to hold their guitar "square" to the body. Instead, for the best posture, it should be held such that the neck is pointing slightly *away* from the player, allowing both arms to assume a more relaxed position.

If a footstool is causing you any problems, you might also like to try a support device called the NeckUp which is used by many players here (I have one myself, but decided that I preferred elevating my foot).

Could you perhaps post some pictures of your playing position?

[PeterT]

Also, one common mistake that players make when trying this position is to hold their guitar "square" to the body. Instead, for the best posture, it should be held such that the neck is pointing slightly *away* from the player, allowing both arms to assume a more relaxed position.

If a footstool is causing you any problems, you might also like to try a support device called the NeckUp which is used by many players here (I have one myself, but decided that I preferred elevating my foot).

I think that holding it square is at least part of the issue. I was also doing that with it on my right leg and then realized that holding it away from the body is much more comfortable. But holding it away from the body is what makes it difficult to fret properly.

I'll experiment with the classical position some more. I find it really awkward and unstable.

Using a footstool was bothering me and I got a guitar cushion.

Thanks for the suggestions.

[ljguitar]

...Thanks for the suggestions.
Hi Peter and welcome to the forum...
The cushion should do essentially the same thing as the neckup (I use NeckUps on all my guitars when seated, and play right knee).

If you move the cushion out a bit toward the knee and then tilt the top edge of the body of the guitar back against your chest, and elevate the headstock to between chin-&-eye level, you want adjust the placement so the fretting hand easily reaches the first frets.

What kind of guitar are you playing (classical/nylon or acoustic 6 string)? What size body? And are you small, medium or average sized?

[PeterT]

What kind of guitar are you playing (classical/nylon or acoustic 6 string)? What size body? And are you small, medium or average sized?
I have a Larrivee OM. I started off with a Taylor dread but it felt too big.

I am average height but have a small build.

I found a video on youtube on the classical position.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxR_esEw_xs

After watching it several times I started getting the hang of it when I used a foot rest. Still need to work on it with the cushion though.

Putting my right leg like that seems to put a strain on my back.

[mmmaak]

I found a video on youtube on the classical position.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxR_esEw_xs
That video reminded me of something I neglected to mention earlier, in relation to angling the neck away from the body. The left thigh (whether using a footstool or cushion) should be tucked in closer to the body rather than "spread eagled", which some students have a tendency to do. If the fretboard is not at comfortable distance in front of the body, it can result in fretting-arm fatigue.

[PeterT]

I had a button put on the heel of my guitar today. Now with a strap I find it easy to play in the classical position.

[tbeltrans]

This is an issue I struggled with for quite some time. I tend to prefer smaller-bodied guitars such as a classical and the 000 or 00 steel string. My classical is a handmade Manuak Papazian that does have somewhat smaller dimensions than most classical instruments. But with every guitar, I have not found a TRULY workable position for one niggling reason or another, though most standard positions seem to work OK (except the stool whcih seems to cramp my leg for some reason). I have the smaller Dynarette cushion. I have the original Neckup from when they first came out years ago. I have tried the traditional footstool. Maybe some people's bodies are just better suited to playing the guitar than others are. Even with a strap, the typical guitar has always felt a little cumbersome to me.

What changed that for me was the Cargo carbon fiber guitar. It just fits me perfectly. I use it with a strap, and can either stand or sit. I am not suggesting that the Cargo is right for everybody, but instead that different guitars with different dimensions are worth experimenting with. I really like the short scale of the Cargo (22 3/4", I believe), where many find it too crowded. The 1 3/4" nut is nicely spaced for fingerstyle. The material the instrument is made from seems to lend itself to shaping that really fits the body well.

It really is a matter of "to each his own". That extends to guitar body dimensions and scale too. So I am suggesting that it may be worth while for the long term to broaden your scope of experimentation to include various styles and sizes of guitar too. Somewhere in all that is available today, you will find the right combination of what works uniquely for you.

Tony

[PeterT]

What changed that for me was the Cargo carbon fiber guitar. It just fits me perfectly. I use it with a strap, and can either stand or sit. I am not suggesting that the Cargo is right for everybody, but instead that different guitars with different dimensions are worth experimenting with. I really like the short scale of the Cargo (22 3/4", I believe), where many find it too crowded. The 1 3/4" nut is nicely spaced for fingerstyle. The material the instrument is made from seems to lend itself to shaping that really fits the body well.

Tony

After reading about the Cargo earlier this week I have been seriously thinking of getting one. I live in a rural area and none of the dealers here carry them. I don't like ordering guitars online but I might make an exception this time.

[tbeltrans]

PeterT:

Go over to:

http://carbonguitar.com

...and you will see lots of discussion about carbon fiber guitars (including alternatives to the Cargo) as well as pictures and even YouTube type demos of the various carbon fiber instruments. The site is hosted by MacNichols, who is a dealer of a couple of different brands of carbon fiber instruments including Rainsong and CA Guitars and another called Emerald Guitars.

I didn't buy mine from them, but am hearing good things. The important thing is that you will find a very active group of carbon fiber guitar owners and those who are considering a purchase. I am very satisfied with my Cargo, so I would obviously be biased in my views. But you can certainly hear pros and cons over there, since there are many who prefer the larger instruments. Those are also ergonomically designed and may be worth consideration too.

Unfortunately, I personally feel strongly that it is a good idea to try before you buy, and have said so in that group. I realize that many can't do that very easily. But I believe that MacNichols has a trial period, and probably other online dealers do too. You may find that you really take to carbon fiber guitars, but it could also be true that you don't. But in any case, it is certainly worth looking into.

Tony

[africaturtle]

I strongly recommend you watch this video, it's for a ten-string guitar, but I applies well to our 6-strings too.

Hope this helps.

G.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ogDip7S3XWo

[kats45]

Here's a link to a great position. It puts the neck in a classical position, but the guitar is on the right leg, but it requires a strap.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vb5UTcewNXg